Controversial Project Topic?

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JesusRocks765
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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JesusRocks765 » Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:19 pm

If you do not want the baby, drop him/her off at an orphanage, it's a better life than no life.

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MadAce
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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by MadAce » Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:35 pm

JesusRocks765 wrote:If you do not want the baby, drop him/her off at an orphanage, it's a better life than no life.
Life=suffering.

No life=no suffering.

Make sense much?

Not that I'm saying abortion is the supreme solution.





Dammit. My system is really crap at determining whether I'm pro or con abortion. How annoying.

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JuliusCaesar
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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JuliusCaesar » Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:36 pm

When did we start talking about babies? I'm talking about a fetus.

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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by Mel'Kaven » Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:06 pm

JesusRocks765 wrote:If you do not want the baby, drop him/her off at an orphanage, it's a better life than no life.
How would you like to live life knowing you were unwanted, to never have real parents?

Orphans do not live happy lives, I think it would be better to kill it as a fetus(since they dont even have thought processes yet) than to simply give away a child like that. It seems so evil to just say "Here you go, you were never wanted.", instead of saying, "Oh Im killing off my tissue before the parasite develops because its going to live a horrible life!"

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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JesusRocks765 » Fri Oct 28, 2011 4:14 am

No, it's actually saying "I dont want this baby, please raise it and maybe he/she will do something great in life" versus "I dont want this baby, please kill it"

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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JuliusCaesar » Fri Oct 28, 2011 4:54 am

It isn't a baby, it is a fetus, and it has no feelings, no conscious, no thought, feels no pain, and is as human as your kidney is, nor are you "killing" anything, for it is not alive.

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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JesusRocks765 » Fri Oct 28, 2011 5:18 am

You are incorrect, It DOES feel pain and IS a human, it is at the first stages of life and deserves the chance that everyone has - the Right to live.

Your kidney doesnt grow into another human being or have a soul, a fetus does. It is biologically and spiritually a human being, so killing it is morally wrong.

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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by General_Neox » Fri Oct 28, 2011 7:50 am

nature vs nurture

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JuliusCaesar
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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JuliusCaesar » Fri Oct 28, 2011 7:56 pm

JesusRocks765 wrote: It DOES feel pain and IS a human, it is at the first stages of life and deserves the chance that everyone has - the Right to live.

Your kidney doesnt grow into another human being or have a soul, a fetus does. It is biologically and spiritually a human being, so killing it is morally wrong.
Prove it can feel pain. Prove it has the self awareness which charactarizes humanity and seperates us from most animals. You claim it has the right to life, what about the mother's rights? This isn't a simple matter of one person, there is a dynamic between the mother and fetus. Now, If the mother wants an abortion, as a whole I'd stick with a reasoning, thinking mother's position rather than bind her to the the rights of a something which has not an iota of self awareness, and regulate something which quite frankly we have no right to regulate.

And with simple genetic manipulation, that with the potential for being a human can just as easily be turned into a kidney or a tooth. Do not attempt to make an argument based on something with "potential". Do not oppose this because it is "biologically human", because so is a kidney. Should each egg be impregnated before it is passed during menses? Each egg can be a human. Each molecule we ingest can be allocated to fueling a spermatozoa. Potential is a bunk case.

I and billions of other people disagree with your catholic concept on the term "soul", thus in the secular legal world (or at least in the US perspective) your bringing up of spiritual matters on the stance against abortion is moot. However, for completeness' sake I post this from the Vatican's website's complete catechism:
The human body shares in the dignity of "the image of God": it is a human body precisely because it is animated by a spiritual soul, and it is the whole human person that is intended to become, in the body of Christ, a temple of the Spirit
This states that the body is animated by a soul. Thus, without animation (which in the classical and biblical sense meant being conscious, something a fetus isn't until late term) a body has no soul. The quotation even mentions how the body-soul complex is that which is the potential sent from your god. Now, being that a fetus has no soul, it thus has no potential or sacredness marked by your god, it is as much a vessel as a dead body is.

Edit: Not that I believe any of the crap I just posted from the catechism ofc

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GRAWRG.
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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by GRAWRG. » Sat Oct 29, 2011 2:22 am

i dont feel like reading everything just now, but i wanted to add that cost likely plays a role in abortions. idk how BBQ works elsewhere, but in the states medicaid DOES NOT COVER birth control pills. perhaps it's more cost effective to just abort? or maybe... considering most people arent logical... people just figure they cant pay the birth control cost, and dont think ahead. then they get pregnant. then they're forced to deal with the problem.

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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JesusRocks765 » Sat Oct 29, 2011 2:39 am

A baby's nervous system develops early on, so abortion is very painful to a sensitive and completely helpless baby.

A baby has a soul and a mind, and by "potential" were not talking about something that "could" happen, we are talking about something that will happen unless the baby is murdered within it's mother.

Anyways, why are you arguing so strongly for a womans "right" to kill their baby? I assume it has something to do with your emotionally detached impairment but still - you're a guy, if women really want abortions then let them speak up and stop supporting what few of them support, I doubt most women agree with abortions and it is just their boyfriends influencing them to "make it easier" on their lives.

I await your futile defence of this terrible act.

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JuliusCaesar
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Re: Controversial Project Topic?

Post by JuliusCaesar » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:56 am

What the eff? I posted a huge reply to this and it didn't go through apparantly....or it was deleted. Anyway I'll sum it up quickly before I go.
JesusRocks765 wrote:A baby's nervous system develops early on, so abortion is very painful to a sensitive and completely helpless baby.

A baby has a soul and a mind, and by "potential" were not talking about something that "could" happen, we are talking about something that will happen unless the baby is murdered within it's mother.

Anyways, why are you arguing so strongly for a womans "right" to kill their baby? I assume it has something to do with your emotionally detached impairment but still - you're a guy, if women really want abortions then let them speak up and stop supporting what few of them support, I doubt most women agree with abortions and it is just their boyfriends influencing them to "make it easier" on their lives.

I await your futile defence of this terrible act.
The fetus' nervous system develops and is capable of feeling pain sometime between 24-30 weeks of pregnancy, less than 1% of abortions are carried out after week 20. 100% of women who become pregnant feel pain :roll:

A baby could be born ONLY if the fetus is supplied with oxygenated blood (from the mother), water and nutrients (from the mother), and birthing (from the mother), not to mention for it to be at all successful would require massive amounts of time and money, which isn't always available (a huge percent of them are undergone by women in sub-poverty threshold incomes). The fetus is owed nothing at all, no right to life no shot at anything. It owes the mother for life should she choose to give it. It won't simply "will be".

Women DO want and support abortions. Something like 80% of unplanned pregnancies end in such, and last I checked the lines between pro choice and pro life activists, this means many many women are one unplanned pregnancy away from reassesing their views :roll:

And as I have said before, I argue for the right for women to choose whether or not they want an abortion. If you have such a huge moral issue with the topic, save it for if/when your wife/girlfriend wants to get one and you have something to say about it, THEN your input is valid, until then you have no place to put your morals on someone else's decision for their own body. And WHERE IN THE HELL did you get the idea that most men force their women to have abortions? You really have no clue what goes on in real relationships, do you? Have fun dying alone :D

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